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The input slope is a really useful feature - allowing one to set a desired slope and then just using a flat (horizontal) threshold which can be lowered to the right level (often, I find that no further tweaking of the threshold envelope is required after this).

My request is for a similar slope for attack and release times so that time scales with frequency.  When this "time gradient" control is at the centre position, if I have a flat horizontal attack envelope which is set at 200ms at 25Hz, at 50Hz it becomes 100ms, at 100Hz it becomes 50ms, at 200Hz it becomes 25ms.  Alternatively, there could be a mode where time scales (one-to-one) with frequency, and the envelope times are now indicated by number of cycles rather than milliseconds (that would be pretty cool!).


Please check both attack and release evenlopes again - they already allow you to define 200ms/25Hz 100ms/50Hz, etc.  You need only two nodes for that.  Hense you already get that 'slope' control just by moving the envelope up/down or adjusting one of the nodes.

Why would you want to see number of cycles?  And can you give an example of 'time scaling one-to-one with frequency'?


Aleksey Vaneev wrote:

Please check both attack and release evenlopes again - they
already allow you to define 200ms/25Hz 100ms/50Hz, etc.  You
need only two nodes for that.  Hense you already get that
'slope' control just by moving the envelope up/down or
adjusting one of the nodes.
Yes.  But see the parallel I'm making with the input slope to see what I'm saying - If I want to have a threshold which drops by 6dB per octave I can either set an envelope that does this, or I can leave the envelope flat and change the input slope from 0 to 6dB.  Just two different ways of doing the same thing, but using an input slope makes envelope adjustments easier and quicker.

It is common practice, for me at least, to set shorter attack/release times higher up the frequency spectrum.  A time gradient would do this for me in the same way that input slope does for threshold.

Why would you want to see number of cycles?
Because it is a measure which is independent of frequency.  It also provides security that the compression will not produce distortion (by setting attack/release to a value greater than a few cycles).

And can you give an

example of 'time scaling one-to-one with frequency'?
I just mean that the attack and/or release time = A/frequency, where A is the number of cycles indicated by the envelope, and frequency is in Hz.


I understand your 'cycles' idea which can be very useful.

Still I cannot understand how you apply input slope concept to the attack and release envelopes.


If the gradient control goes from 0 to 2 then let attack/release time = envelope*(P/frequency)^G, where G is the gradient control value, and P is the "pivot frequency".  Does that make sense?

Maybe just a separate macro style function which will automatically set the Attack and Release gradients...  Maybe there could be, say, 5 presets which are just Attack/Release 'envelopes' (Splines?) , and there could be a little combo button which you can select and it sets these two envelopes based on these common values.

Maybe this is just unwanted complexity, but I must say I struggle to find useful values for Attack and Release and usually just use a rather random approach...  I know I need to spend some time with it.

I can understand why you would not want to bother implementing such a feature since it is probably just a lack of understanding and lazyness on my part.

Anyway, whatever setting Soniformer always seems to sound great, so maybe my rather slapshod Attack/Release settings are good enough.


A very useful technique that I have found to work on many occasions is to set the attack time to the equivalent of three or four cycles across the spectrum, so that at 25Hz it's about 160ms, at 500Hz it's about 8ms, and so on.  With 32 bands it's possile to set much tighter attacks with Soniformer than with any other multiband compressor (where distortion might occur at the bottom end of each band).  A time gradient control would allow me to do this quickly and easily without having to indulge in mental maths, it would also allow me to exaggerate or diminish the tightening up of attack/release times as frequencies rise.

Andrew, but as I have said already, this is possible to implement simply by moving two nodes.  Since attack/release scales are logarithmic you already have this x^G control.  I do not see why would you want to apply this to the whole envelope as this can make things a little complicated.

As a new Soniformer user and someone who always feels like a beginner about these audio things, I think that such a relative time/cycle mode would be good.  It's something that I haven't even thought of before, but now that Andrew mentioned it, it seems like a very natural way to look at the attack and release times.

Yes, the effect can be achieved by doing a few calculations, and setting up a straight ramp line, but... :) It would be interesting to see, how a relative time/cycle mode would change the way people use the plugin.  If it's something one should always take into account when setting attack times, why not show it and support it directly? :) Soniformer already converts milliseconds to samples, so why stop at that? ;)

It's a bit like those tempo-sync delays in audio sequencers.  Sure, you can set up any note-value delay by doing some math or looking up the millisecond values from a tempo vs. note length chart (as you have to do with an outboard non-VST-aware delay box anyway), but still most VST delay plugins offer a direct way to enter the delay length in terms of musical note values (quarter note, eigth note, dotted eight, etc.).

I'm not sure if this would really be used or not.  But nobody's ever implemented anything like that before, so how could we know?


I'll see if I can implement this.
This topic was created before release of the latest product version, and it may contain details irrelevant to this version.  Replying is disabled for this topic.

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